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NT-Gold Rush-Alaska

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#21 ·
Ron, so glad to hear from you, my son and I watch the show every week, we love it!!!! I was hoping you would chime in on some RR that I would of assumed went towards that quartz creek site, if they say there was so much mining there had to be a RR there.

What do you think about that Dutchmans way of mining, he sure did have a big pan of gold, and someone had to find gold to afford all that equipment.

Tom H
 
Discussion starter · #22 ·
Posted By tom h on 05 Dec 2011 05:52 PM
Ron, so glad to hear from you, my son and I watch the show every week, we love it!!!! I was hoping you would chime in on some RR that I would of assumed went towards that quartz creek site, if they say there was so much mining there had to be a RR there.
Are you kidding ? The KMR is my all-time favorite NG railroad. Once I saw that the Hoffmans were heading into the Klondike, I began taking a very close look. The green line shows the actual route the Hoffmans used to travel between Dawson City and their claims on upper Quartz Creek. The route definitely intersects the historic end point of the KMR, MP 31, near Sulphur Springs, and passes just to the south of the old KMR wye. Shown in gold is section 2 of the KMR line--the segment which ran from Grand Forks to Sulphur Springs. Most of that segment is now inaccessible, but there is a nearly-parallel road to the immediate south, downhill from the old RR grade--the upper Bonanza Creek Road--which is the other route into Dawson City. Click image for a larger view.


What do you think about that Dutchmans way of mining, he sure did have a big pan of gold, and someone had to find gold to afford all that equipment.

Tom H

I either missed that episode or I just don't know to what you are referring.
 
Discussion starter · #23 ·
From this sign, you are looking more or less south. The ridge you see should be the west wall of upper Quartz Creek, which is in a narrow gulch. The access road follows the spine of that ridge to the creek. You can see part of that road in the distance. Upper Bonanza is the road leading to Grand Forks, and from there to Dawson City. Posted By blackburn49 on 03 Dec 2011 06:29 PM
This sign is at the junction of the Bonanza Road and Sulphur Springs / Quartz Creek Road near Solomon Dome.
I've been there, although that sign was not there back then.


Image
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
It's looking pretty exciting for the Hoffman's in this episode. . .
I have been scanning what views there are of the countryside to try to confirm its location. It is not quite where I originally placed it. The claims are in a slightly wider part of the valley than the section I had thought. However, it also appears that what I had thought was the old dredge was something else. I have a better fix on it now. . .
 
#25 ·
Yeah, its nice to see them starting to get going. The quarry guy (cant remember his name) is a great addition. He knows what he is doing and lights a fire under their rears.
 
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#27 ·
Ha ha Randy. It would seem that since real gold is around $2000 an ounce it would have to mean that Fool's Gold is gotta be worth at least half that, right???
 
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Discussion starter · #28 ·
Site A is the apparent abandoned dredge location based on my most recent analysis.
Site B is where I first believed the dredge was located. However, subsequent analysis makes this site less probable.
Site C was the area I had originally marked as the furthest extension of dredging operations. The problem is that the valley is so narrow here that what appears to be dredge tailings piles are more likely remnants from a bull-dozing operation.

There is a second branch to Quartz Creek on the left, which is to the west. However, my analysis of the aerials does not reveal any likely massive dredging operations there. Instead, it appears that the entire area was disturbed by more conventional bull-dozing methods. On the other hand, the creek branch to the right contains the remains of a large dredge pond at what I now consider the practical limit at which a large dredge could have advanced up this gulch. I am no expert on this, of course. I can only make comparisons with similar operations within this same area. I have seen the size of these dredges and dredge ponds, both in the Yukon and in Alaska.
In any case, I now believe that somewhere in the vicinity of Site A would be the most-likely location for the Gold Rush-Alaska claims. More maps to follow will show additional details. Be sure to click on this map for a closer view.

Also note that this site is indeed very close to the historic end of the Klondike Mines Railway line at approximately KMR MP 31, just west of Sulphur Springs, a gulch which leads into Sulphur Springs Creek.

The green line is the road to Dawson. The gold line is the end of the KMR railroad grade. There is also an orange line which was a historic road to Gold Bottom Creek. That road is now abandoned. I traced it in as a way of further solidifying the exact location of the Sulphur Springs wye--the historic turn-around point for the KMR.

 
Discussion starter · #29 ·
This second Google-Earth map clearly shows the location of the KMR wye, which is as close to scale as I could get it. As you can see, the existing road (green) passes over the western part of that historic railroad turn-around. As you can clearly see, when viewing the larger map (click map image), the end of the KMR runs along the top of a narrow ridge. The wye was designed to turn the narrow gauge engine plus just four cars. The KMR used to make an annual passenger run to this point and hold a picnic at King Solomon Dome for the residents of Dawson and Grand Forks. They had two passenger cars, and possibly two additional open cars, to transport passengers. For a time, the KMR also ran stage lines from the end of the line at MP 31 to other points such as Hunker Creek, Readford on Quartz Creek and to camps along Sulphur Springs Creek. They also had a mail contract into these gold camp areas for a brief time.

Makes me want to get back into historic railroad modeling just going over all of this.
 
Discussion starter · #30 ·
Closer views of the likely area where Gold Rush-Alaska's Quartz Creek claims are located:
Site A includes the large dredge pond near the upper reaches of the east branch of Quartz Creek. The location of the abandoned dredge is unclear from these images, but typically the dredge would be left on the upper end of the pond. There is a likely point near Site A where this could be. Regrettably, no sign of this dredge pond has so far appeared in the series, but there would have to have been one, since these dredges were, in fact, large floating barges.
 
#32 ·
Carl....there's only one way you can say that with knowledge....and I'd NEVER admit it....hehehehehhehe

I do like the show...love folks that are entrepreneurial...however, some aspects of the show make me think it should be called "Dumb and Dumber"
 
Discussion starter · #34 ·
Posted By Ray Dunakin on 10 Dec 2011 10:05 PM
I've never even heard of this show before, but it's interesting to see the comments about it here, and even more interesting to see the stuff about the KMR. I do recall seeing the earlier thread you posted about that railroad. Neat stuff. Are you writing a book about the KMR?

I have given this historic topic considerable thought over the last several years. The KMR would make an ideal backdrop for a new historic novel. The Klondike region, particularly Bonanza and upper Bonanza Creek, and the abandoned Native village of Moosehide, would be my first choice for a second book.
 
Discussion starter · #35 ·
Over time I have managed to piece the entire 31-mile KMR line together on a Google-Earth map. Here you see it in gold. The modern Bonanza Creek road is in light green:
Klondike area in a line drawing map, showing existing roads:

 
Discussion starter · #36 ·
This is Klondike Mines Railway, Section 1, from the RR junction to Bear Creek complex--the "Guggieville Spur," MP 2.85 to Grand Forks, MP 13. The gold line represents the original KM RR grade and the green line is the existing Bonanza Road. Tracing the old RR grade and placing it on Google-Earth represented an interesting challenge. Very little of this segment of the old grade survived, especially from the Guggieville spur to the KMR Ry bridge. All of that was destroyed by mining operations within a few years after the KMR abandoned its right-of-way in 1913. Fortunately, two studies done in the last decade pin down most of this route and I was able to determine the location of the grade within a reasonable degree of accuracy. Most interesting to me was that the old RR crossing is gone and the new road crossing of Bonanza Creek is well upstream from the old crossing. Once the road crosses Bonanza Creek, however, it does closely follow the RR grade from that point to the site of Grand Forks.
It is this kind of research which is necessary to credibly construct a plan for historic recreation of an old railroad line. That way, at least, significant features can be found and included in the planned layout. Section 1 started at Dawson City, KMR MP 0, and ended at Grand Forks, MP 13. This is NOT the segment I would rebuild, but it was well worthwhile to attempt to retrace it. In any case, for those of you who have ever been there, or even plan on visiting the Klondike (WELL worthwhile) here it is. You WILL see elements of the old RR bed along the way, even in the section nearest the Guggieville turnout. I have not been there in decades, but I do recall seeing parts of that RR grade along the hillside along the way. I also recall seeing the old RR bridge that once led to Guggieville, which is a reference to the Guggenheim money that was behind that massive gold dredging operation of the 1920s and 30s.
 
#38 ·
Posted By blackburn49 on 12 Dec 2011 04:44 PM
I take it NOBODY else does this . . .
Nope, but it's fascinating how you do it. I spend all day fiddling the tiny details of ridiculous client demands.
 
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