G Scale Model Train Forum banner
Cancel
Create thread New Forums

Wood for ties/sleepers, What i am experimenting with.

Jump to Latest
21 - 34 of 34 Posts
#21 ·
IGOR!
you sir, are one creative guy! Keep going! And dont stop! I'm from oregon in the usa, i live in a lumberjack town, and have asked about different kinds of wood, all the lumberjacks have recommended redwood or red cedar. So i too have experimented and found red cedar soaked in used diesel oil (from my local mechanic) for my crossties. Some of my trackwork has been outside for over 10 years now and i still have not had to replace any! But i also use a PVC ladder Sub roadbed to hold all this in place. And for spikes, #18-1" brads/nails go through the ties into the pvc sub roadbed securing the aluminium, code 332 with 1/2" by 4” ties, for a more narrow gauge look, and with all due respect to the rivet counters and scale perfectionists out there, at 10 feet away, i've been told by real railroaders, "that is the most realistic track i've ever seen!" So, keep on tracking! :D
 
#22 ·
I use oak ties and brass or nickel silver rails to make my turnouts. My old turnouts on my older layout lasted from 1981 untill now (2022) and are still going strong although I have had to rebuild quite a few from left hand to right hand to fit on my new layout. I treated them in a mix of creosote (now unavailable) old motor oil and a bit of tar paint this keeps the colour much longer. I admit that I have had to change a few ties now and then either because they split or warped (on long switch ties) or even rotted. But not many. I use brass pins to hold the rail down instead of spikes because I lived in a very humid environment in the greater Paris erea, with my track wet from late october until march (steel spikes would have rusted through). Therefore I drill through the rail base to hold the rail down with these a tedious process. As these come loose after a while I regularly push them back in , lately I have begun to make copper U shaped clips from electrical wire (usually salvaged) stripped and formed into a U shape and pushed through holes in the ties then bent over the rail base. This I do every 3 to 4 inches to secure the gauge throughout, this has given these fairly old points a new lease on life. These old ties are 1cm X 1cm section. the 3 turnouts on the outside track are olds rebuilt.
Image


On the inside track is a new build which uses much thinner Oak ties of 1cmX 0,5cm at a much closer tie spacing to be compatible with the Märklin track with which I equiped my new pikes mainlines, same overal technique, however I feel that in the much dryer climate which I live in now in Ardèche I can risk using much thinner ties besides at my age I dont think that I will need to use this railway more than twenty years from now anyways. This is a much larger radius switch a N° 10 which is supposed to represent a medium speed prototype switch (say a N° 20) The older switches are all N° 8 as I have found that with buffers and hook and chain, continental couplers with this size switch there is no buffer locking (by experience). The frogs are built up and soldered to a brass plate which keeps everything in place. The tie rods are 1,5mm diameter brass rod, the points are insulated beyond the frogs on the inside rails.
Image

I have been operating with this trackwork on my old railway for nearly 40 years with very few derailments at all speeds All in all my new layout now has 28 turnouts of which only 5 are from the trade, and I must say that these are the ones that give me the most hastle. These N°10 points have been in service now for over a year with no problems either.
Image

This photo shows the same erea now with ballast and more scenicked with the stone walls. it is my representation of Horseshoe curve at the correct radius. the line veering off to the left leads to the wye, (the track had been kicked out of alignement during the ballasting). it is still not ballasted and is my old track dating to 1978 still in good use having been renovated in 2016, the lead at the far left will be going to the steaming bay and should be laid down shortly now. along with the turntable. The other lead to the wye is in the background on a high brick wall these go to the indoor terminus. The bridge over the tracks in the right foreground will be disguised as a tunnel (Gallitzin) and is for the lawn mower access to the garden. The layout is steam and electric by track power.
Cheers, Simon
 
#24 ·
Simon, what standards did you use for your trackwork?

With the very "long" frogs of #10 etc, the wing rail dimensions and flangeways are tricky.

Would also be interested in your standards for wheels, mostly flange thickness and depth.

Beautiful stuff !!!

Greg
 
#25 ·
Well as we all know if you go fine scale (a thing I once practiced in HO scale many years ago) you have a captive layout, where friends can't come to enjoy a run or an operating session. Because of that, I have set my layout to the G1MRA standards, but a bit closer to fine scale like 40mm (Or just a touch over that) back to back on most of my scratch built stock. It works very well. I also regauge any equipment that isn't to those standard. I use an old hand drill mounted on a column, that I bought at a flea market years ago (my first drill press) which has a screw feed as wheel puller or press to set wheelsets the way I want them. But for the reason stated above I stay within the G1MRA standards. Flange depth is usually 1mm to 1,5 mm. I returned the flanges on my earlier MTH units (GG1, F3 the more recent VO1000 and PA1 is 1,5 mm, too bad they stopped making them, just when they had figured it all out...) This is because my earlier layout had much smaller rail around code 190 or so available in France and which was perfect for the much lighter French railway rail, I still use it recycled on the Y portion of the layout. Of course having a sturdy concrete base very carefully made is a big advantage and helps to go towards fine scale. With track laid on gravel and loose as often seen in garden railroads you need the rigidity of the heavier rail. The photo below shows my scratch built 2D2 9100 (in brass) coming out of the indoor terminal on this recycled handlaid track. (It will be ballasted sometimes in the futur; Once ballasted it looks very realistic this track is 38 years old renovated with one new tie every other tie in 2016)

Actually I learned to make pointwork when I was thirteen years old because I wanted to model narrow gauge HOn3 and in the sixties ready made turnouts for that gauge didn't exist. Then when I moved up to gauge one I just kept the same methods I had learned in many fine Model Railroader articles of the time. At that time I used files to make all the parts, frogs, and switch rails, which was tedious. Then later I speeded things up with the use of a grinder. Now I make my switch rails almost ready to use with the grinder, I just do a small clean up with the file after shaping them with the grinder. I also benefited from many very authoritative articles in the G1MRA Newsletter on some of the finer points in pointwork by Stewart Hines and a few other authors.

Having friends visit for a run or GTG is one of the most pleasant aspects of this hobby.
Best, Simon

Image
 
#26 ·
Igor, I love your track. I have been thinking of making my own track for all the usual reasons, but also because I like solving problems and making things. I have a different approach I am attempting, and have just started the process of evaluating tie wood and preservatives. I found reference to a USDA Forest Products Laboratory mixture that is 'non-toxic' and supposed to work even on pine, made from mineral spirits, wax, and linseed oil. I will keep yo posted!
 
#28 ·
Is steel rail out of the question due to rust, or is there a reasonable preservation method that make it reasonable to use with dead rail installations outside? I like the look of the rust, but I wouldnt want it disappearing in a year or two! I dont have a good feel for how long steel would last if on a could pebble ballasted roadbed with decent drainage.
 
#29 · (Edited)
The Staver live steamers: Home (click it)

have a large layout of steel strap rail. They use (and re-apply) a compound that keeps rust down... most of the track is indoors but there is significant trackage outside.

Contact them for the compound they use, it is doable.

Greg
 
#31 ·
Greg I now use a two mm thick piece of brass shim epoxied to the bottom of the frog where wheels drop occures and this completly cured the problem of that very unrealisting shifting of locomotives and cars as their wheels drop into the frog. I did a complete coverage in the last issue of the G1MRA Newsletter titled: "frogs delight" It isn't that much work and is a boon to the realism of trains smoothly going across trackwork. Its really one of the worst telltales that says toy instead of prototype. It was recomended practice in NMRA in other scales since WW2 and it works very well as most of my wheels have less than 2mm flanges I place them so they are 2MM from the rail head top. Even Märklin 4 wheelers now sail through smoothly with their coarse scale wheels. Being live steamer I can't go finescale because then my layout would be captive meaning pals coundn't come and have a run. I got the idea from two Hübner 10° crossings I used which had this feature, as I discovered that all my rolling stock sailed through that beautifully I applied it to the rest of the main line. Strap rail works fine as seen at Stavers and weathered and ballasted even looks realistic from a distance. The problem is with turnouts making the switch rails necessitates machining and is quite ajob I understand that at Stavers one man is the master of that job.
Santé, Simon
 
#32 ·
Agreed, with our specifications, it is almost impossible to support the tread of the wheel through high-number frogs.

adding the insert to make this a "flange bearing" frog (or close to it, helps the problem of wheels dropping into the throat of the frog.

I have stainless steel inserts for my #6 switches:
Image


Image
 
#33 ·
Greg Elmassian said:
The Staver live steamers have a large layout of steel strap rail. They use (and re-apply) a compound that keeps rust down... most of the track is indoors but there is significant trackage outside.
Click to expand...
Greg,
There is no longer any track outside, although Larry Staver is planning on something one day.
Just got back from their annual steamup this year, and attached is a short movie of my Tom Barratt built Cardean class loco running on the excellent track.
Cheers,
David Leech, Canada
 
21 - 34 of 34 Posts
About this Discussion
33 Replies
13 Participants
Last post:
Greg Elmassian
G Scale Model Train Forum
posts
460K
members
32K
Since
2007
A forum community dedicated to G scale model train owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about collections, displays, models, styles, scales, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
Live Steam General G Scale Discussions Beginner's Forum Model Making Track, Trestles, Bridges and Roadbed