[LFOCD]

HI All,
I am new to adding batteries and RC gear to G scale locos, and I've watched many install videos but few give details of parts and supplies. My current project is to convert a brand new 38231 PRR Mogul with smoke and lights to RC and battery. Piko makes a 35042 receiver and handheld remote but cautioned me about adding batteries to the tender as they have heard about them exploding. Unfortunately, they do not provide much more detail about overheating and they mention an aluminum heatsink for the pc board but only say that "it is a simple one" with no details as to the size or purchase information. Since the loco is new and it has the Soundtraxx compatible module in the tender already, I hate to rip all that out, so I'd like to try and use the 35042 unit (if you all think it is good) and add a battery. For cooling, I thought of adding a micro fan but I haven't a clue as to which one to use. If anyone has a recommendation or a website that might detail such useful items, I would appreciate it. I live in southern California and I think ti is probably is a good idea to cool the electronics trapped in tenders and tight spaces with fans so any details would be appreciated.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Piko warned you that batteries might explode in the tender?

Who and where is this person? You implied this is a Piko employee or official document. Please produce that reference.

There are lots of ways to go remote control... and you should think through your decision, like RailPro, Blunami, BlueRail, the (ugh) Piko remote, and many more.

Let's go over some details of what you want. I am in San Diego. I really want to know where you got the exploding information.

Greg

 

[LFOCD]

Hi Greg,
Here is the email from yesterday. I suspect it is just to protect themselves as they haven't done it.

[email protected]	Fri, Mar 10, 4:13 PM (17 hours ago)
to me

We recommend the 35042 receiver for locos with decoders. The 35040 outputs a pulse-width modulated wave form that can cause issues with decoders. The 35042 outputs pure DC.

The style of the heat sink is not so critical. We really don’t have any specific recommendation.

This sort of install gets into a “non-factory” modification, so we have not done a video about it. We have seen exploded tenders from customers who put the batteries in the tender. It’s possible, but there is a risk.

 

[LFOCD]

Word of note. My intent on the question wasn't to cause controversy it was simply to ask for recommendations and what fan, heatsink, and charging situation I could use. Yes, I could pull all the factory stuff out and put in Rail pro or Blunami but this thing is brand new and intended as a gift and Piko's stuff while people might hate the remote works nicely and their locos are fine and good way to start. My friend can always upgrade to blumani later if he wants. My question was just a simply innocent suggestion for advice. I did not intend to cause any issues with Piko or anyone else, so lets not over react and simply help.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

No problem, it was apparently CYA from Piko. Batteries we use don't explode, but they must be paranoid. Where did they want to put the batteries? In the boiler so that can explode instead? I guess Piko does not want any batteries period.

A gift? Put it all in the tender, get a good charger that treats the batteries nicely. Use the Piko remote as advised to keep it all Piko.

Greg

 

[David Leech]

Batteries we use don't explode

Depends who 'we' are.
A lot of people that I know are into using Li-Po batteries
See this site for details on whether those batteries can explode.

https://racingrccar.com/lipo-battery-safety/

Cheers,
David Leech, Canada

 

[David Leech]

Just to correct myself.
The last people that I was in contact with are using LITHIUM-ION batteries, which can still catch fire and explode.

Battery Safety : Top 5 Reasons Why Lithium-Ion Batteries Catch Fire — ION Energy

If a lithium-ion battery fails, it will burst into flames and can cause widespread damage. Which is why battery safety is a key function of a BMS.

www.ionenergy.co

Cheers,
David Leech, Canada

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Article has "explode" in title, but all descriptions are fire.

I'll take my information from a better source.

Here's a guy with a PHD and also in the navy:

Why do Lithium Ion Batteries Catch Fire or Explode?

Luckily, major explosions caused by Li-ion batteries are an uncommon occurrence. If they are exposed to the wrong conditions, however, there is a slight chance of them catching fire or exploding. Mathias Henriksen’s (USN) PhD project focuses on the combustible gases released from a...

mozees.no

explosion is very rare

I suggest you read a bit more about explosions... big difference from burning...

 

[David Leech]

So Greg, are you saying that explosions with batteries can never happen, or that they are rare?
I would rather ere on the side of being safe, and assume that they are possible.
But then you always have to be right.
Regards,
David Leech, Canada

 

[Greg Elmassian]

can you read? i guess not... re read my post

 

[Pete Thornton]

explosions with batteries

I had a battery expand and get hot when I was trying to start my outboard motor, but it didn't explode or burst in to flames.

Greg - can we get back to the original topic and stop nitpicking? Anyone can google exploding batteries and get chapter and verse on them.

 

[Pete Thornton]

And back to your regularly scheduled program . . .

Piko makes a 35042 receiver and handheld remote

I have heard that it works very nicely and is not expensive, so I suggest you try that.

I've installed lithium batteries in many, many locos without incident. Just make sure they are 'protected' with a built-in circuit board that stops them being over- or under-charged. The 14.4V packs are usually considered adequate for smaller locos that don't have 4 motors.

parts and supplies.

As you probably gathered we don't see the need for cooling fans, and a heat sink should be already included with the receiver board if it needs it, which is unlikely.

The switch is usually a DPDT center off, with one side connected to the charging jack and the other to the electronics. The battery connects to the center pins. Any size you like, but at least 1 Amp capacity on the switch.

Charging jacks are your choice, but standardizing is suggested as then you can use the same charger with multiple locos. I use 5.5mm by 2.1mm as my standard, as they are used for LED strings and are cheaply available, e.g.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832566575872.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US
You can find them on eBay or Amazon if you don't want to wait 4 weeks for them to ship from China!

Finally, a 'smart' charger that will charge your engine is a good investment. Tenergy makes on for about $30, e.g.
Tenergy TLP3000 1.5A Charger for Li-Ion / Li-polymer battery Pack (14.8V 4 cells) - UL approved

 

[Dachshund Tim]

Article has "explode" in title, but all descriptions are fire.

I'll take my information from a better source.

Here's a guy with a PHD and also in the navy:

Why do Lithium Ion Batteries Catch Fire or Explode?

Luckily, major explosions caused by Li-ion batteries are an uncommon occurrence. If they are exposed to the wrong conditions, however, there is a slight chance of them catching fire or exploding. Mathias Henriksen’s (USN) PhD project focuses on the combustible gases released from a...

mozees.no

explosion is very rare

I suggest you read a bit more about explosions... big difference from burning...
[/QUOTE
I'll take my information from my family members who are actually firefighters and respond to fires caused by lithium batteries. The guy has a PHD and is in the Navy, I would say possibly works for the Navy, look at his hair and beard, not military cut. I won't even get started on someone with a PHD from my life experiences.

 

[LFOCD]

And back to your regularly scheduled program . . .


I have heard that it works very nicely and is not expensive, so I suggest you try that.

I've installed lithium batteries in many, many locos without incident. Just make sure they are 'protected' with a built-in circuit board that stops them being over- or under-charged. The 14.4V packs are usually considered adequate for smaller locos that don't have 4 motors.


As you probably gathered we don't see the need for cooling fans, and a heat sink should be already included with the receiver board if it needs it, which is unlikely.

The switch is usually a DPDT center off, with one side connected to the charging jack and the other to the electronics. The battery connects to the center pins. Any size you like, but at least 1 Amp capacity on the switch.

Charging jacks are your choice, but standardizing is suggested as then you can use the same charger with multiple locos. I use 5.5mm by 2.1mm as my standard, as they are used for LED strings and are cheaply available, e.g.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832566575872.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US
You can find them on eBay or Amazon if you don't want to wait 4 weeks for them to ship from China!

Finally, a 'smart' charger that will charge your engine is a good investment. Tenergy makes on for about $30, e.g.
Tenergy TLP3000 1.5A Charger for Li-Ion / Li-polymer battery Pack (14.8V 4 cells) - UL approved

Thank you Pete, much appreciated for the advice and detail . I will check out the information and the links, just what I was looking for Sorry for setting off a firestorm on batteries <wink>

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Yeah, silly but there is a rabid anti-lithium battery group... of course they all own laptops, digital watches, rechargable earbuds, cell phones, toothbrushes and many have electric or hybrid vehicles.