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This thread was started in an attempt to alleviate thread jacking in another forum.  Who wants to talk about 1:32 stuff?  Richard?  :D;)/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/tongue.gif
 

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This was started in the live steam forum and I don't think most of the fellows there will know it's now here. I would suggest that it stay in the live steam forum, as they are the most likely to want 1/32 rolling stock. Live steamers especially need 1/32 heavy weight passenger cars as well as proper freight cars. As we all know Accucraft is coming out with 1/32 mid 1930’s AAR 40 ft. boxcars at a reasonable price.
 

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It may have started there, but it never belonged there. 1:32 rolling stock is used by modellers with all types of power, not just live steam.

Mark
 

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Well, as I was saying over on the live steam forum, things seem to be improving in 1:32 these days, with the much-needed Accucraft boxcars looming on the horizon, and many of the old MDC cars and parts now available again from Mainline America. Mainline America are also have all-new 1:32 hoppers and an RS2 in development according to their website.

Although stock MDC cars are a little toylike with their molded-on grab irons, oversized wheels, and loosely-scaled length, they can be made into a decent-looking car with a few simple modifications. Here are a couple of MDC boxcars that I have stretched to scale length and fitted with Accucraft 33" metal wheels. I'm planning to write up a detailed article about these and other MDC modifications in the not-too distant future.

 

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This is an initial list commercially produced 1:32 scale North American freight cars
==============
BRASS
Box Car 40 ft  PS-1 / brass / PSC
Box Car 40 ft USRA double sheathed wood / brass / Barratt Rwys (Accucraft)
Box Car 40 ft Round roof single door / brass / J&M Models  crude by current standards
Box Car 40 ft Round roof double door / brass / J&M Models  crude by current standards
Reefer 40 ft SFRD / brass / Row & Co  (Samhongsa)
Reefer Modern steel REA express / brass / Accucraft   NOT YET DELIVERED
above car came in 5 different ATSF slogans w/maps
Stock car 40ft UP modern steel / brass / Row & Co  (Samhongsa)
above car in mineral red and yellow versions
Tank car ICC-103 single dome / brass / PSC
Gondola drop bottom composite / brass / PSC
Caboose SP C-30-1 wood sides / brass / PSC
Covered hopper PRR HC1(?) / brass / Eastern Rwys (Samhongsa)
Hopper 55T USRA / brass / Eastern Rwys (Samhongsa)
Covered hopper, variation on the 55T USRA  / brass / Eastern Rwys (Samhongsa)
Flat 50 ft / brass / Eastern Rwys  (Samhongsa) has metal deck
Flat 50 ft / brass / Fine Art Models  (Samhongsa) has wood deck
the above car came with loads, M41 tanks, propeller, naval gun, usually with display track and case (Smithsonian Model)
Caboose PRR N5c porthole windows / brass / Fine Art Models , usually with display track and case (Smithsonian Model)
also available with the GG1 electric and PRR M1a 4-8-2
Caboose SP C-30-1 wood sides / brass / PSC
Caboose SP C-30-1 wood sides / brass / Accucraft   NOT YET DELIVERED
Caboose UP CA-1  wood sides / brass / Accucraft   NOT YET DELIVERED
Caboose PRR N6 / brass / wood / Aster

Bob Uniack produced (resin ?) kits for the following:
Gon 40 ft SP configured for beet service
Reefer 40 ft wood (?)
Caboose SP bay window (?) MY memory may be failing on this one

Model Die Casting produced the following (close to) 1:32 cars in plastic:
These cars are ALL slightly oversized.  The hoppers are close to 1:30, The reefer is too tall
Gary Raymond did a series of articles in Finescale Railroader deltailing how to make the box car
a much better model.

Hopper USRA 55T 2 bay offset side and ribbed side versions, also offered as a covered hopper
Box Car 40 ft single door generic
Reefer 40 ft generic

Mike's Train House (MTH) has produced several cars.  The original box cars is closer to 1:32 than the MDC models
The cars are getting slightly larger, creaping toward 1:30.  The 50 ft flat is much larger than the brass models
of the same prototype. Gary Raymond did an excellent article on modifying the MTH 40 ft box car to represent a detailed
1:32 freight car.  Sorry, cannot find the magazine right now.

AMS (Accucraft) plastic
Reefer 40ft PFE highly detailed, hated by many for that reason, continued handling results in missing and broken parts
Box Car 40 ft  ANY YEAR NOW
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This list is far from exhaustive, please make additions and / or corrections

This should get Kent's motor running!   /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/laugh.gif

Cheers
Jim
 

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I noticed someone posted a query regarding the prices of brass rolling stock over on the LS Forum.

I cannot say whether the Accucraft cabooses (Cabeese?) are worth $399 MSRP, or the REA reefer is worth $315 MSRP. Here is some perspective on brass pricing.

Remember, these cars are usually produced in runs of from 100 to 250 units. They are hand assembled, hand painted, hand lettered (no pad printiing here). You would think the cost is in the labor. WRONG. The major cost (NOW) is the shipping cost from Korea or China. Container shipping costs are based more on volume than weight. A 1:32 freight car properly packed in a foam lined box takes up between 8 and 12 times the space of the same car in O scale. This was determined by comparing physical boxes, not math computation.

Historical information:

Precision Scale Co (PSC - Iron Horse Models) freight cars in the mid 1980s (20+ years) cost between $225 and $ 275 each
Eastern Railways open hopper cars circa 1990 cost about $325 to $350
Barratt Railways box car by Accucraft cica 1996-97 cost $325 to $345
J&M (UK) box cars circa 1985 in early 1990s cost close to $400
Fine Art PRR caboose $595
Fine Art flat cars with loads $600-$700

AS A COMPARISON, right now, O scale brass freight cars from Kohs & Co are in the $600-$900 range, RY Models are in the $285 to $350 range.

IF the cars are excellent model representations of the particular prototype, and accuracy is important to you, then $350-$450 is what the market price is. If generic freight cars are ok for you, then your upper limit should probably be under $100, probably less.

Just my thoughts

Cheers

Jim
 

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I just reread my first post on this topic and made a misleading statement in regard to the MDC box car. I said "oversized". They have the wrong prpoportions; too short, too wide, a little too high as delivered with an unmodified underframe and truck mounting. The sides of the reefer are much too high. The hopper is just oversized in every dimension. For the hoppers, it becomes very apparent if you put them next to an Eastern Rys brass model. Running behind the Mike or Berk you would not notice unless you have "calibrated" eyeballs.

Jim
 

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I'll abide by the observaton of "If generic freight cars are ok for you, then your upper limit should probably be under $100, probably less" and enjoy a string of these along with the expense of our locos:
Street price will probably be under a hundred per car

http://www.accucraft.com/index.php?show_aux_page=107
 

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Charles

The good news is that they have listed the proposed road names, the better news is that there are six numbers per car. The thing I am waiting for is to see whixh lettering they are using for each car, since most of these railroads had multiple schemes even for their "box car red / freight car red / mineral brown (pick one)" box cars. The only thing I would bet on is that the cars are ALL the same color. If they are as good as the PFEs, I will eventually have a lot of MDC cars "on the block".

Alan

Regarding brass car prices, I checked my records and found some more sobering numbers:

UP stock cars from Row and Co, original price in about 1998 $485 each
SFRD reefers with curved map and train name lettering from Row & Co, $595 each, also old in sets of two for $1175
SFRD reefer with straight map and "Ship and travel" lettering from Row & Co, $625 each

According to someone who spends time on "EvilBay", these cars are still fetching high prices, but have not appreciated in value.

DO NOT base your retirement on a warehouse full of Aster locomotives and brass freight cars.

ADDITION TO THE LIST:

Caboose NKP "High Speed Sevice" /metal shell with wood exterior / Sunset Valley Railroad (Peter Comley) short run to match the Aster Berkshire
these units were built using the same construction methods Pete uses for his LNER (UK) teak sided coaches

Cheers

Jim
 

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Hey Jim,
An addition for your list, somewhere in the depths of my addled brain I am able to recall a Pennsy caboose made by Aster, yes? These still come up for sale occasionally, not a bad model, probably on a par with J&M boxcars. I'm doing my damnest to get Accucraft to make 80' smooth-sided streamliners, since they would be too large for Accucraft's injection moulding presses I have suggested extruded aluminum with milled windows and all the add-on stuff in injection moulded plastic. They like the idea and are 'working on it' so in about 2012 maybe something just may appear, we can only hope. Accucraft and the Good Lord move in mysterious ways!

DM-K
Ottawa
 

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Can you guys place some links to where I can buy stock for the S2 :D coaches or wagons.

Also I need to see some pictures of these 'Empire Builder' coaches or other coaches the S2 pulled ,I cannot find any. I have spoken to someone that may be able to press these shells out in aluminium :)

Tony
 

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The MDC boxcars are based on the 1937 AAR design (same as the new Accucraft cars, naturally), and their main problem in terms of dimensions is the length, they're about 3 1/2 scale feet too short. The body height is just about perfect, and the width is ok give or take a couple inches. The overall height suffers because of the oversized wheels, which scale out to about 39" instead of 33" on the prototype. The reefers apparently used the same basic mold as the boxcars, just with different side details. The ends, floor (inside and out), and overall dimensions are identical. Although this makes for an overly tall reefer, it actually worked in my favor for lengthening my boxcars because of the wider panel spacing on the reefer sides. The MDC boxcars have the right number of side panels (for a 10-panel car), but they're compressed to fit the shorter length. The wider spacing of the panels on the reefers is pretty close to what the boxcars should be, so my lengthened boxcars are actually reefer bodies with boxcar door sections grafted in. The roof panels, on the other hand, are just about the right size but there's one fewer than there should be. That makes stretching the roof a simple matter of lengthening it by one panel.

The ore cars are another one where the oversized wheels are a problem, making the car too tall. They're also about 2 scale feet too long, presumably stretched to fit the stock MDC trucks which are too long for these cars in addition to the oversized wheels. The real cars are 24 feet overall to match the spacing of the pockets on the ore docks, which are also spaced to match the hatches on the ore boats. The trucks should have a 5-foot wheelbase, the MDC trucks are about 5'10". There's not a whole lot to be done about the overall length, unfortunately, since the streching seems to have been done in the sloped areas rather than the midsection. However, 5-foot wheelbase trucks from Ozark and Accucraft 33" wheels really help the appearance of these cars and make for a nice heavy train too. Body-mount Kadees are also a must for these cars for prototypical close-coupling.
 

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D M-K

The Aster PRR N6 (Pennsy) is the last item under BRASS on my initial list.

Is your intent to ask Accucraft for specific prototypes (ie window arrangements matching Pullman diagrams), or just do "generic" smooth side cars? I thought Alan Wright's CP coaches looked pretty good when I saw them at DH a couple of years ago. Of course they had those CP trucks that were not common in the USA. For modern cars, Jack Verducci did an article on lengthening MTH cars and rearranging the windows to match cars on the D&LW Phoebe Snow.

Richard

I am looking forward to a "how-to" on building the box cars from reefer shells. I have a bunch of the MDC reefers as unlettered kits that would be great for the project. I thought I was being "dumb" when Chris Gans (Nicholas Smith Trains) dumped them on me from the back room about 15 years ago. Cost me $12 each, but I had to take them all. Have you found a suitable replacement brake wheel and rachet housing for these?

Tony 23

On the Live Steam forum there is a topic like "Aster S2 coaches" . In that thread Jim Overland said:

I do think we should discuss potential sources and encouragement for 1:32 heavyweights for the S2.
The Kerns cars seem a bit expensive to me.
Something less than $500 per car and in the right consist, Pullman sleepers 8-1-2. etc. See the Great Northern historical site.
===========
The Kern Valley cars started out with the molds and parts from Ralph Brown's Standard Car Company line of 1:32 heavyweight kits. The kits assembled like an old walthers HO or O scale kit. The sides were resin castings, floor and underbody were wood, roof was plastic (which bowed after prolonged outdoor use). They had their own six wheel trucks. In the 1980s these kits cost over $300 each. Kern Valley has been rengineering the cars, redone the molds with a finer level of detail, made the underbody parts as castings, and done very nice interiors. I think a $500 price tag is acceptable given the amount of labor involved in production, and the relatively low numbers of cars that will ever be sold (of any given floor plan). Low numbers means hundreds not thousands. I will guarantee that even Jim O would not sell them for less if he was doing the work. If you don't want to pay for someone else's efforts to research, design, and produce (for a profit), go buy a plan book full of heavyweight drawings and start building. Let me know how you feel after the third car. People do it all the time. Check out Marty Cozad's posts on building 48 ft Bethgons on this Forum. Not as complicated, but he has the builders spirit.

David Leech built a lot of streamlined cars to order over the years. MOST folks thought they represented good value for the money. Depending on the painting, lettering, and level of detail; these cars ranged from $400 to $600 each. I believe that IF he had done heavyweight cars, they would have been at least the cost of the Kern Valley versions becuse of the extra labor involved.

I suppose one could get some older J&M cars that were made for the Aster NYC Hudson and PRR K4. they would not be the correct cars, but they would be 1:32. They would also cost as least as much as the Kern Valley cars.

Cheers

Jim
 

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DMK

An additional comment regarding your post:

An addition for your list, somewhere in the depths of my addled brain I am able to recall a Pennsy caboose made by Aster, yes? These still come up for sale occasionally, not a bad model, probably on a par with J&M boxcars.

The Aster caboose was an accuarate model of a specific class of PRR cabin car, with fine detailing. It has thin wood veneer for the sides, ends and cupola, as well as nice steps, railings, and ladders. It also had working couplers made by Aster. I think they were originally about $200 or $250 back about 1984. I have seen them sell for $500 and up recently.

The caboose is FAR ABOVE the J&M box cars. The ladders are cude stampings with flat rungs. The doors and ends are rudimentary stampings. I think the round roof (closer to the N&W turtleback) was chosen becose a flat roof was easier to make. There is absolutely no underbody, just a single brass channel soldered lengthwise in the center. The trucks attach to the end of the channel, there are no bolsters. The truck sideframes are a crude (plastic?) casting with little relief. Dummy couplers that made Lionel's cheapest look good. The wheels are the worst I have ever seen on a 1:32 model. Why didn't they put the Aster couplers on the box cars? Cost, I guess.

It is hard to believe that John Gumo (Gauge One America) brought in during the same peroid:
(MY PERSONAL, HIGHLY BIASED RATINGS)
Aster NYC Hudson and PRR K-4 Pacific - great models
Aster PRR cabin car (caboose) - excellent
J&M heavyweights NYC (Pullman green) and PRR (Tuscan with and without stripes). Good models outside, interior very basic. Did have excellent working couplers (I think from Aster). The trucks were "lead sleds", and needed to be reworked. Listed at $800-$850 in 1984
J&M box cars - Given the existence of the very good PSC box cars (for the same money or less), should have been pushed off the boat on the way here from the UK.

More than you wanted to read.

Jim
 

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On the Live Steam forum there is a topic like "Aster S2 coaches"

www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/11/postid/11327/view/topic/tpage/5/Default.aspx
 

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Posted By GaugeOneLines on 02/24/2008 7:59 AM
Hey Jim,
An addition for your list, somewhere in the depths of my addled brain I am able to recall a Pennsy caboose made by Aster, yes? These still come up for sale occasionally, not a bad model, probably on a par with J&M boxcars. I'm doing my damnest to get Accucraft to make 80' smooth-sided streamliners, since they would be too large for Accucraft's injection moulding presses I have suggested extruded aluminum with milled windows and all the add-on stuff in injection moulded plastic. They like the idea and are 'working on it' so in about 2012 maybe something just may appear, we can only hope. Accucraft and the Good Lord move in mysterious ways!

DM-K
Ottawa

That is very good news indeed! I've stopped holding my breath for 1:32 rolling stock; I breath easier, but the alternative of shrinking the 1:29 stuff is not as attractive to me as simply waiting.

Mark
 

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Posted By Dr Rivet on 02/24/2008 9:27 AM
D M-K

The Aster PRR N6 (Pennsy) is the last item under BRASS on my initial list.

Is your intent to ask Accucraft for specific prototypes (ie window arrangements matching Pullman diagrams), or just do "generic" smooth side cars? I thought Alan Wright's CP coaches looked pretty good when I saw them at DH a couple of years ago. Of course they had those CP trucks that were not common in the USA. For modern cars, Jack Verducci did an article on lengthening MTH cars and rearranging the windows to match cars on the D&LW Phoebe Snow.


Jim,

I completely missed the item...............I'm not really stupid, I just look it!
They would be to Pullman Standard design and would be just a small choice such as coach/chair car, dining, kitchen/lounge and baggage car. A round ended observation would increase the price but would be a possibility. Target price between $250 and 300. I KNOW that they'd sell an enormous number if offered in different liveries.  Alan's CPs are lovely but are $600ish each and on top of that his order books are full until June/July with British outline stock. He is attempting to stay focused on British and CP which is a very smart move, I have friends who are well into their second and third years of waiting for their orders from David Leech (well worth the wait).

Cheers
DM-K
Ottawa
 

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/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/whistling.gifStill waiting for a link to see what an S2 pulled /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/whistling.gif
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
1:32, Hmmmmmmm... What would I pick for the ultimate car? That is easy, a flat car. Then I could place anything on it. It might be a 1:32 '67 GT-40. Perhaps a '32 coupe rescued from some field in South Dakota. Wait, what is that? OMG, it looks like the hull of the Cutty Sark, only a bit smaller. Old steam tractors, tanks, coils of cable, every giant bulky item that built this country which couldn't be loaded into a boxcar, went on a flat car. Where is the affordable flat car?

We just saw wonderful entries in the Conrad contest. Isn't it time for the new MDC, or perhaps Accucraft to come up with a flatcar? And once this car is released, lets have a Flatcar contest. What would you transport, and make it exciting? I wonder...
 
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