G Scale Model Train Forum banner

1 - 20 of 47 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
43 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
First off, Is there no links page on this forum that has like links to common mfgs, vendors, and so forth?

Next, I have an 1000 sq ft house so there's definetly no room for an indoor layout, which means I'm going outside. Luckily I have 11.15 Acres to work with! (I'm not trying to track the whole thing but to say the least I have no limits) Now I'm in the proccess of building a pond and would kind of like it to loop half way around that. Now can track power be used and the track not be layed in a complete loop?


Next question I want my layout to include like to small yards on each end, various grade changes and a long straight where I can build up alot of speed, what kind of speed can say a modern diesel hit? And is there realiability issues at top speed as faras derailing and such? (im just trying to figure how important a nice long straight would be to me)


last question for now. I have a decent understanding of track power, DCC, and battery and R/C. In my head it seem like it would be better for me to combine R/C and track power. Is that possible and is there a link that explainds how to do such?


Thanks for your Help and this is just a few of many more to come. I'm sure even your answers will generate more questions.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,144 Posts
Posted By RRwannabe on 01/26/2009 7:10 AM
First off, Is there no links page on this forum that has like links to common mfgs, vendors, and so forth?

Next, I have an 1000 sq ft house so there's definetly no room for an indoor layout, which means I'm going outside. Luckily I have 11.15 Acres to work with! (I'm not trying to track the whole thing but to say the least I have no limits) Now I'm in the proccess of building a pond and would kind of like it to loop half way around that. Now can track power be used and the track not be layed in a complete loop?


Next question I want my layout to include like to small yards on each end, various grade changes and a long straight where I can build up alot of speed, what kind of speed can say a modern diesel hit? And is there realiability issues at top speed as faras derailing and such? (im just trying to figure how important a nice long straight would be to me)


last question for now. I have a decent understanding of track power, DCC, and battery and R/C. In my head it seem like it would be better for me to combine R/C and track power. Is that possible and is there a link that explainds how to do such?


Thanks for your Help and this is just a few of many more to come. I'm sure even your answers will generate more questions.




Dear Mr Whateveryournameis - I think you'll find that many of the supporters of this website are actually dealers in one way or another selling just about everything you could possibly imagine, from custom decals in vinyl or paint/ink to steel bridges, and trains of all kinds.


The fact is that the USA [if that is where you live] is SO big that touting one vendor or another in the in these days of the internet, advising you on any one particular dealership is pretty fruitless, unless you tell us where you are located and we can advise you where the door is that will lead to the things you want - your profile has no information of any kind, not even your name, and you didn't sign off with a name either. Many here subscribe to, or buy on the odd occasion, the 'Garden Railway' magazine, that seems to be full from one end to the other with vendors, all very keen to take your money off you - and looking at your plans, that will keep a few lucky store-owners in clover for quite a while. I just counted over 120 vendors in my last copy....

Your other questions will bear answering from those here who actually have large layouts with long straights, Marty Cozad in Nebraska City somes to mind first off there. I think you'll find, looking at his layout on Youtube, that he keeps to the more sedate side of running, rather than trying to emulate the NYC's famous and late Mr Jones with velocity. A quick look at my physics text book tells me that it is not the length of the straight that matters, but the need to negotiate curves without projecting the long and heavy train into the next county. Like the man said - it's not the speed that actually kills you, it's the sudden cessation of movement.

tac
http://www.ovgrs.org/
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,620 Posts
Are you thinking of a point to pint or having a reverse loop at one end. If so then you create more problems with more wiring unless you use DCC or battery. If using DC run feeders every 50 ft or so. Yards can be where you choose to put them. Running fast can cause derailment unless you do some good track work then the problem goes away. Depending on the locos you buy speeds can vary. If we knew the exact type track plan you are doing folks can give you more Idea's on types of power to use. Other folks will chime in with lots of info. Later RJD
 

·
Been around awhile
Joined
·
131 Posts
RRwannabe,
The purpose of modern diesel/electric locomotives is economical movement of freight. Speed is always a secondary consideration. For speed nothing beats the steam era passenger trains. The fastest recorded is from the 1890's. Empire Express 999.


As a result, most modelers are content with speeds that scale to the prototypes. The motors and gears are built for pulling power rather then speed. With the controller set for full throttle you may be disappointed with the maximum speed attainable. Besides, with a steam locomotive there is more moving parts to watch wizz around.

Yes, there are track power packs with R/C controllers. These are very common and are simple to wire. You just hook the power pack to the track as usual.

Dave
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
428 Posts
Try this page for links to all of the Large Scale Manufactures. The page contains links to all of the manufacture's of locomotives and cars, not the 1000's of other manufacture's that make all of the assecories. That kind of links page is hard to keep up as the smaller manufactures tend to come and go.

There is also a page of Online Forums. Look which forum is at the top!


Russ Miller
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
658 Posts
Typical diesel freight locomotives are geared for about 65 MPH. I believe AMTRAK's engines are geared for 105 MPH.

Long straight tracks are, IMHO, boring. The biggest problem is that you will have fits with rail expansion on long straight tracks.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,510 Posts
I, too, wanted a long straight-away to get some Highball action in. My track is two loopbacks of about 17-ft diameter on the ends of a 50-ft straight section. It is all elevated at about 3 to 4 feet so I can play with my Live Steam loco without being on the ground so much. This gave me some concern about speeds and reaching the loopback curve at the end of the straight section. I intended to build my line in a bit of a bowl shape, that way I could accelerate going down to the middle of the line and use the uphill part to have gravity help apply the brakes before the curve at the end. But my intentions failed and my track is pretty level all the way. So I have to pay attention to the throttle when runing trains... but that is why I run them anyway so that is just part of the fun.

I have discovered that from one end of the 50-ft straight section (I wanted lots more, but have only so much room) that it is hard to determine how fast the train is going at the other end. I was also a bit surprised at how small the train is when it is 50 to 60 ft away!

My track is all free floating in ballast, yet it still will catch somewhere along the way (many places, actually) and will move sideways a bit under heat expansion, so my "straight" section is never quite as "straight" as I intended.

I do like the straight section and it is fun to get up to 120 Scale MPH with my Mikado(s), but I wish I had the room to make some long sweeping curves around small hills too.

I recommend that if you make a squiggly track that it not be just a bunch of "S" curves, the curves need to exist for some purpose, like going around a water feature or small hills, where it would make ecconomic sense for the RR to have built the track that way... easier to go around than to go straight through, or produce a better grade to snake up a hill than to try to go straight up (you don't actually have to have a grade to make it look like you do, just place some hills in the way of a straight line and have to track snake around them!)

You seem to have plenty of room for both a long straight section for high speed running and some wide sweeping curves to come back via. BOTH are fun!
 

·
Super Modulator
Joined
·
20,525 Posts
To address your last question, you can make almost any power system work anywhere. Depending on your climate, the amount of effort you want to go to, and your budget.

[*] Battery and wireless r/c [*]track power and wireless r/c [*]track power and "wired rc" (like DCC)
[/list] can all work just fine in most locations

Rather than repeat the endless debate on which is better, I suggest you first figure out what you will expect to do on your layout, and your priorities, for example:

[*]how many users at the same time [*]how many locos at the same time [*]multiple locos/consisting needed [*]Budget [*]length of trains [*]etc. etc. etc [/list]

I'd recommend reading some "getting started" books.

I have a FAQ section on my web site: [url]http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mainmenu-27/beginners-faqs-mainmenu-49 [/url]

Modesty aside, read ALL of them!!

Your locomotives will come ready for DC track power. Unless low cost of track is a priority (and that is a reasonable situation!), you can set up for track power initially, but there's even fundamental choices in track material, and if you go to the trouble to make it "bulletproof" conductive.

My best advice is to read, there are TONS of track vs. battery threads here.


Regards, Greg



 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
991 Posts
Greg is right,

I started learning all about trains on this forum and the various threads. Hours researching and reading/viewing.

Then I would post outrageous ideas (still do) on this forum and in turn get slapped around and straightened out by the experts.


I have yet to turn the turf for my track construction project however how I build it is confirmed. As for technology, practical Vs personal needs reigns. Study the threads !!! All of the technology is good...


And finally, where do you live! If in "frost" country I have ideas !

gg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,731 Posts
You could also use MTH DCS system as well, it will run on DC, DCS,and soon DCC. it is a great system with sounds and chuffing smoke that 2nd to none, in my opionion. and is installed already in all mth locos and can be fitted to anything with a flywheel...its really cool to operate and is equally as impressive as the other systems, as been said, you have so many choices, read up and use the one that bests suits what your looking for.. heres a video of a aristo mikado with MTH system running on dc only and with MTH smoke unit. 2nd video is of 2 dash -9s running on track power with QSI plug and play system for aristo locos, witch can also be used with dcc.... 3rd video with track powered sd-70s with phoenix sound.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
991 Posts
Steam locomotives adds class to the railine and the MTH DCS system brings it all out ! If you like puffing smoke and Engine "sound" that is.


Check out Raymond's website if you want to hear the sounds and understand the technology. Be aware however DCS is not universal compared to DCC. (Study the threads on this forum)

http://www.rayman4449.dynip.com/




gg
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,620 Posts
Also remember MTH is 1/32 scale as compared to USAT and Aristo which is 1/29th. As they say read and do the home work. Later RJD
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
991 Posts
I ordered the book off Amazon today...

Great reading coming !

gg
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,716 Posts
Sounds like you have a great location. My X now has our little house and 2 acres.

I think you want to spend some time reading forums, the garden railways magazine, visiting people and seeing how different people do things. As soon as spring comes, get a loop of track on the ground and run a train. Then, whilst the train is running, sit back in a lawn chair, think about what you've seen and read, and decide what you want to do next.

R/C and track power is quite workable. In fact, an R/C loco is a great accessory on an otherwise track powered layout. I usually run mine on track powered layouts, except when I visit Ric or Marty who have no powered track. Of course, since I now live in motel, my equipment only runs when I go visiting. Fortunately, I have this beautiful garden just half an hour away :D
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
43 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Thanks for the replies! I know there not going to be fast but I don't want to watch my trains run in constant loops at constant speed. I want to to be able to as Semper Vapro was saying handle my trains. Like, for example, couple a dash 9 to a short inter-modal consist in a yard. Pull out of the yard into some tighter corners then into a long sweeping one, build up some speed down a long straight then slow it back down before entering some more curves and another yard. I know what Modern diesel locomotives are for but there are freight trains that high ball though the dessert and other rural areas at 70 mph. I don't want loops at either end because from what I've read on here there more trouble than there worth, unless you have batteries but who wants to change/ charge batteries up all the time. (Haha, its joke, just being here a week or two and I've read more arguing over power than anything) I want basicly a yard on each end and a wye to turn the power(locomotives) around in each yard. With some small industry switching and passing sidings in between yards A and B. When I get a chance I'll make a quick drawing in ms paint I guess.


As far as my engines, My lay out will consist of Modern diesel freight, I wouldn't mine a steamer to run from time to time but they all seem fairly pricey and I have less interest in them as I am young and well.... you know how that goes. I feel it will be mostly just me running but who knows, I also am going to stick with 1:29 scale stuff as it seem more readily available especialy for modern stuff as i found out in my last thread


Now knowing that Track power and R/c are capalbe together I have a few more questions. Say I want to run a SD-70 and Dash 9 together Are There R/c parts capable of making those trains run at the same speed like I was reading about in a DCC thread?

For some reason I just forgot some of the stuff I was thinking
but i'm sure it will come to me agian tommarow while I m day dreaming at work. Thanks again and hope i'm not being to much of a nuisence.
-Ryan
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
991 Posts
Ryan... with this last comment...

"Now knowing that Track power and R/c are capalbe together I have a few more questions. Say I want to run a SD-70 and Dash 9 together Are There R/c parts capable of making those trains run at the same speed like I was reading about in a DCC thread?"

You have just opened pandora's box !

DCC Vs DCS....

How techno-saavy are you and where do you want to put your efforts? Techno side or Garden side?

I will now leave you to the GURUS here on this forum.

gg

PS: Evaluate DCS and DCC in any final decision.
 

·
Super Modulator
Joined
·
20,525 Posts
Yes, but I think you are getting into the details a bit quickly.

I will assume your question is literally what you asked: can I match speeds of 2 locos, and with a single control for the 2 locos.

Yes, and the systems that come to mind are: (track power systems listed only, since he put that there)

The new Aristo TE system (out soon) (You are welcome Lewis)
The MTH DCS system
Any DCC system
Any AirWire-based system (pretty darn close to DCC)

I just know I left something out, but someone will be here fast to correct me, ha ha ha.

Regards, Greg
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
43 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
well then let me further clarify on that.All I need to worry about is me running for now, more than likely Aristo and USA engines. I want to be able to run 2-3 engines at a time(as in 1 power lash up) as well as maybe two seperate locos at a time (as in drive one the turn on another and drive it without the other moving) And I definetly want track power and a hand held "Cab" or controller . I DON'T WANT BATTERIES


I guess when I Say R/c I feel like I should be able wire in a "chip" of some kind that includes some type of ESC and a way to opperate Accesories such as lights and sound and bam Im good to go. I'm sure I'm wrong because I haven't read anything that simple about power on here yet. It Seems like DCC is more complicated and cost more to setup but I'm still reading and learning. I know In DCC you need the decoders and a power supply and the transmitter(maybe multiple transmiters) and a cab. right?
 

·
Super Modulator
Joined
·
20,525 Posts
You can either use an R/C system that forces you to follow the loco (antenna in loc) or a system that has expandable base stations (antennas on the ground).

The first method may wind up being cheaper, but you might find you can only control a loco you are close to.

The second method is what I use, where I have several base stations to cover a large area, all part of a single system. The base stations communicate with the hand held throttles, and then the system puts the signals on the rails.

There's a lot of ways to solve this problem.

Regards, Greg
 
1 - 20 of 47 Posts
Top