[White Deer RR]

So while I've had my Aristo 0-4-0 starter set on the ground since 2006, I only recently stopped lurking here and had my first post here (with photos!)


http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi....com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/23/postid/101364/view/topic/Default.aspx


What can I say, I'm slow and not particularly handy. Definitely a beginner after three years.


After I immodestly stated I'd had little trouble with my stainless track, a few days later everything got buggy. Stalls, Basic TE not responsive, etc. I had previously ordered some metal wheels for the two carriages and installed them yesterday. Likely related to using the thing more.


Close examination of the track and 0-4-0 wheels revealed serious crud. So this morning I had time to use some medium grit sandpaper on the track, followed by some household oil wiped off with paper towels. (Luckily this is a very small oval.) I also cleaned the locomotive wheels and the once-used metal carriage wheels.


This evening the Headmistress returned with the Sproutling Engineer (age 9 and very cute) with a menagerie of non-scale plastic animals for the layout (that cow is about 10,000 pounds!)

We ran the train for about two hours, and it was working like new. Obviously one aspect is that with a short oval, the engine is returning to the same spot about every thirty seconds at a medium slow pace. Lots of chances for oxidation.

And that's what I believe happened. I had cleaned the track, the locomotive wheels and the one-day old carriage wheels quite thoroughly this morning. Near dusk, the locomotive started slipping on a slight incline in a curve, so I wiped my finger across the track and it came back black as coal.


Obviously the use of oil could have played a role in the slipping, as suggested by Mr. George Schreyer at his track cleaning tips page.

http://www.girr.org/girr/tips/tips2/track_cleaning_tips.html

Since I have the small layout, I grabbed a Swiffer and stuck a paper towel in it, and removed some black stuff before dark rather easily. Still, I'm rather surprised at how much oxidation occurred, as I've always assumed the plastic wheels were partly to blame. At least tonight I'm convinced most of the black stuff was oxidation. I'm also intrigued by George's theory that dust plays a role. Since my little oval is irrigated it would be trivial to turn the sprinkler on an hour ahead of play time to reduce dust on the rails.


I finished this evening by letting the sprinklers run on the oval, as the plants needed water and it will likely dispense with the small amount of lightweight household oil on the track.

The good news is the train actually ran quite well with the metal wheels, and Sproutling had a grand old time. I'm thinking it might be SOP to just Swiffer the track after running with a paper towel attached, which would at least grab some powdery stuff, and clean the wheels once a week or as warranted.

Best to all.

 

[lownote]

As far as I can tell, the need to clean track is heavily dependent on the local environment. I notice really big differences between how much I have to clean in Spring vs summer, for example. I have about half stainless and half brass, and I notice that in the spring, the stainless is no better than the brass. But last fall, the stainless was WAY better. I have no idea why. Could be pollen on the track? Could be trees and plants giving off sap? Could be the humidity? I just notice significant variations based on the seasons.


In my experience it's really really easy to eliminate the problem you're having--just get an aristo track cleaning car. I run the car around a few times and that takes care of it. If I run the trains for an hour or so then I will usually run the track cleaner around a few times again. Just stick it on the end of a train. It's very effective, it's easy, and it's not expensive. Sometimes I wipe the pad on the track cleaning car with laquer thinner, to clean it, but otherwise it's really maintenance free

 

[jfrank]

The worst thing you can use on track is sand paper. It scores the track surface and makes it easier for dirt to accumulate. If you use kerosene to clean your track it will also eliminate the oxication worries. It works for any scale.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

It's highly doubtful you have oxidizing stainless. There are a few chemicals that can affect stainless, like chlorine, but it's really rare.

What I believe is more likely is your 0-4-0... for many years they had a terrible plating that came off quickly and then the metal underneath oxidized very quickly and helped make crud everywhere. There's lot of data on this, and your 0-4-0 from 2006 may be in that group of earlier ones with the "bad" wheels.

Definitely do not use oil, even kerosene is a bit oily (we used to leave a jar lid of it in grandfather clocks to lubricate them).

ANY track can get covered with crud, like dust, dirt, pollen, sap... but stainless will not oxidize like brass. I have part of my layout that gets hit with sprinklers every other day. That part is always clean. The rest of the track needs a once around with a piece of scotchbrite to get dust, dirt, bugs off the rails.

Regards, Greg

 

[White Deer RR]

Could be the old wheels. George Schreyer's tips page describes it here
The old wheels are a chemically blackened casting with a high copper content (probably a bronze). I do not know the composition of the new wheels, but they appear to be anodized instead of blackened. The old wheels, especially the spokes are flat black in color. The new wheels are dark gray brown with a moderate sheen.


To my eye my 0-4-0 wheels look like the new ones. Maybe I'll snap a photo tonight, after picking up a green Scotch Brite pad.

 

[Totalwrecker]

White Dear,
Welcome to the forums.
I had a similar starter set, first as Greg states they had bad wheels, I replaced mine.

Not all Stainless track from China is equal, out of say a hundred sections of track, I have 3 sections that slow the trains noticably, one leads into a curve and acts as a natural brake, but the other two aren't as easy to overlook. I have noticed that the bad track is darker in color than the true Stainless. I think our residue is from carbon arcing. Yes a firm finger rub of a rail will show black, I tried the
'snake' oil (smoke) as suggested, great if you want to see drivers spin, but I'll never repeat that!

I've posted several times about the 'bad track' yet no one has ever responded to it...... yet we know it does exist! For me it's just another nudge to get off track power and go R/C batteries, which is underway...

One fix I tried was to glue small pieces of scothbrite to the frame to act as track and wheel wipers, worked great until I ran it over wet track and water wicked up into the motor.....killed it!

I would suggest using an electrical contact cleaner spray prior to running using a scotchbrite pad as the cleaner alone won't lift the dirt away. The scotchbrite will polish more than sand the railtops. Scratches in the railtops will agrevate arcing...by reducing the contact area.

Good luck and keep us posted, there is a lot of good knowledge here and most are happy to share.

John

 

[aceinspp]

Here in GA the first few months of spring are the worst for track. Very heavy amounts of pollen get up in the morning a your car has turned yellow from the stuff. A quick run of my rack cleaning car over my SS track will take care of it. Also spraying of the track with water does it good also to get rid of dust. Friend of mine does it after several weeks of non operating. Works good for him. The plastic wheels you had where also part of the problem. Later RJD

 

[White Deer RR]

I tend to agree that most convenient solution for me will be the Aristo track cleaning car.

But---put down your coffee and carbonated beverages, everyone----

I'm not spending any more money on this hobby right now.

Really. I'm just not going to--oooh, look, shiny and new.....okay, next order maybe.

 

[Greg Elmassian]

You don't need to sand off any oxidation, just remove the surface crud on SS.

The Aristo car is a big eraser that has no way to "remove" the gunk it encounters other than to build up on the rubber pad.

I prefer scotchbrite, whose open weave does a better job of collecting the gunk and getting it away from the rails:

You might be interested on my page on track cleaning cars:

http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mainmenu-27/track-mainmenu-93/track-cleaning-mainmenu-272



Regards, Greg

 

[White Deer RR]

Scotch Brite it is, definitely going to pick that up.

Very informative page, Greg, this is what's so great about you folks helping others out. I look forward to checking out more of your web site.

I see what you mean about smearing. I also see how easy it is to convince myself of something that may not be true. Perhaps it's possible for oxidation to be occurring only on the locomotive wheels rather than the rail, and then it is spread around by running? In the end I guess it doesn't matter, some cleaning of track is required anyhow it seems.


My best guess at this point is that as whatever plastic wheel gunk I missed goes away over time using metal carriage wheels, things will improve with some cleaning of the wheels on both the locomotive and carriages. Because I used household oil as a solvent it could have all just become one black goo. So last night's run time was a cleaning session, with giant animals galloping around. Still fun.


Period cleaning with Scotch-Brite will not be a huge problem for me at this time. As someone said in my first thread, small is beautiful!



Anyway, I know you all have covered this topic a lot and I thank you all for your time and input. Happy running!

 

[Greg Elmassian]

You can get a "Sanding pole" from Home depot, and clip a piece of scotchbrite (I like the maroon colored stuff) to it, and you have an inexpensive cleaner for yourself in a couple of minutes.

If you have deposits from the plastic wheels, they will "Go away" after time, but it's definitely possible that it has spread around. The 0-4-0 is notorious for having wheels that gunk up.

Hope this helps,

Greg

 

[Torby]

We have all brass at the Chicago Botanic. Even then, a scotchbright pad is about all we need. It's more of a problem when the weather is wet as the black powder turns to goop and all sorts of dirt splashes onto the rail.

I had stainless in the shop. The only place I had to clean it was were I'd slop water on it filling the stream.

I used to clean my 0-4-0 wheels with a "polishing" sponge in my dremel. Now I run on batteries and don't care what the wheels or track look like.

 

[chuck n]

I have used a green scotchbright pad on a drywall sanding pole for years. I prefer the green to the maroon. I think that the maroon is a little coarser and may lightly scratch the track. I once took a piece of clean aluminum and buffed it with both the green and maroon. I thought that the maroon caused more minor scratching. Sandpaper no matter what grit size is a big NO NO. It will scratch the track which will lead to more problems.

You mention that you have a small loop. If the diameter is small (LGB R1 or R2) the black deposit could be metal and plastic from the wheels that is ground off while going around the curve and then spread along the track. Is there more black gunk on the outside rail than the inside rail?

Stainless steel is much harder that other metals the we usually deal with in our trains. It could be abrading the wheels.

Chuck N

 

[Great Western]

Like many others when new to the hobby the question of brass track soiling arose. Replacing plastic wheels for metal ones made a considerable difference to running. However, pollen, snail trails, and the many natural outdoor occurences do cause some arcing and this in turn needs to be dealt with before a running session.

Initially, having seen sanding poles and abraders mentioned on the Fora I tried that route: not good. I also saw references to scotchbrite pads: very good.

I support the green scotchbrite clan in their observations. I have been using this method, on a pole, for nearly three years and I am more than pleased with the polishing - opposed to abrading - that is achieved. A side benefit is the shine that is evident in sunshine and in the locos headlights on the rails (very prototypical

)

 

[Greg Elmassian]

Chuck, for brass or aluminum, I would not recommend the maroon scotchbrite.

But he has stainless, (so do I), and it's much harder, and I will guarantee you the maroon does not scratch it!

My recommendation was specific to the poster of the thread.

Regards, Greg

 

[chuck n]

Greg

Thanks for the clarification. I was speaking generally and I really wanted to get my paddle in the water on sandpaper. I see it mentioned too many times.

Chuck

 

[White Deer RR]

Yeah, I'll be avoiding sandpaper, although I didn't really torque on it or anything. But point taken in regards to scratches filling with crud. So in regards to the 0-4-0 wheels, I don't know if anyone can identify whether these are the old type or the new type from these photos, but here they are. I ran across the owner's manual for the starter set today, and it says the wheels are "specially BLACK-plated to insure good electrical conductivity...." I can't find a copyright date but there is an order form for Aristocraft's 1995 60th Anniversary edition in the manual. Of course, I've notice Artistocraft does not seem to update their printed materials very often so I don't know if that's much of a clue. Maybe I got really old stock in 2006 from a store I ordered from?

 

[White Deer RR]

I haven't noticed if the inside rails have more gunk, my impression is that the curves have more, so you may be on to something there.

 

[Del Tapparo]

 

[chuck n]

If you are running inside, like under a Christmas tree, be careful if you have a light carpet. Dust from the wheels leaves a mark of all the ties and rails. Trust me, I know of what I speak.

The dust goes up down and around.

To clean wheels on engines, I cut the green scotchbright pads into 1/2 inch strips, and use that to clean the gunk off my wheels.

Chuck