Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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 | | 05/01/2008 5:58 PM |
| Posted By baggo on 04/18/2008 4:41 AM
Hi Everybody,
As the owner of the website quoted from earlier in this discussion, perhaps I may be allowed to comment on the hard/soft solder debate?
It is still perfectly acceptable practice in the UK for the use of soft solder caulking on boiler stays PROVIDED the stays are threaded and nutted on the inside of the firebox. The solder used must be a high melting point silver bearing soft solder such as Comsol (from Johnson Matthey). Ordinary plumbing or electrical solder are certainly not acceptable.
As mentioned, the solder offers no structural strength to the stays, this comes from the threads and nuts, and is merely a sealing agent. Overheating and melting of the solder due to allowing the water level to get too low would merely cause the stays to leak. The boiler would still be structurally sound.
The only reason that this method of sealing the stays was used in this particular boiler described on my website (for a 2½" gauge Helen Long) is the very narrow firebox which makes it extremely difficult, if not impossible, to silver solder the ends of the stays inside the firebox. I myself would not use this method in a larger boiler where it was possible to use normal silver solder.
It would not now be acceptable in the UK to use soft solder in any other part of a NEW boiler and any boiler inspector would, quite rightly, condemn such a boiler if offered for test and inspection. I cannot say for certain but an older boiler using the riveted/caulked construction which passed all the tests MIGHT be passed for further service. It would probably depend on the particular inspector or club.
I hope that clarifies the situation over here.
John
Welcome to MLS John, I enjoy reading your pages and if you find time I hope you stick around here and can pass along some of your insights. Thank you for your response as well. It's always nice getting the info right from the horse's mouth so to speak. I still doubt that method is acceptable here (even for caulking stays), but I cannot remember ever hearing it causing an issue over there. Thanks for the clarification on caulking the other parts of the boiler. The one being discussed here had both the front flue sheet's flange and the flues caulked, not acceptable in my opinion.
Dave, can't wait to see the pics.
As for the new boiler, the flues are in the firebox. The rear sheet has been formed and some of the bushes have been turned and threaded. I'll post pictures this weekend. | | | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 05/21/2008 8:16 PM |
| Here's a long over-due update. Have the rear sheet formed, with the lower water gauge bush and the throttle gland soldered in place. The throat sheet is formed and the bushes for the safety valves have been soldered to the shell.
Here's a couple of the backhead, mocked in place and with the bushes soldered on.
The throat sheet next to its former, and mocked in place.
Girder stay, and both soldered to the firebox.
Safety valve bushes soldered to the shell.
And the front throttle bush, with the steam pipe in place.
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Kovacjr
1st Class Member
Lakewood NJ
Foreman
Posts:372
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| | 05/22/2008 5:44 AM |
| | Looking Good!! What did you end up using for the safety's? | |
Jason Kovac
Lakewood, NJ | |
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Jerry Barnes
1st Class Member
Lexington, NE
Engineer
Posts:1142
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| | 05/22/2008 8:44 AM |
| | Nice work! Jerry | |
Life is too short to take seriously. | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 05/22/2008 10:02 PM |
| | Thanks guys! I ended up buying safeties from Polly Engineering. | | | |
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Britstrains
1st Class Member
Brakeman
Posts:37
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| | 05/23/2008 8:30 AM |
| Looking Great!!! | | | |
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livesteam5629
1st Class Member
Elkton, MD
Foreman
Posts:150
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| | 05/23/2008 8:43 AM |
| Hey Justin,
Do you have a web site for Polly Engineering?
Man is that boiler looking good.
Noel | |
Noel Crawford | |
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Dave -- Use Coal
Santa Fe, Texas
Foreman
Posts:103
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| | 05/23/2008 9:52 AM |
| You should write a book on how to build one of these boilers.
DAYoung | |
Dave Young --- K8DY'
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Kovacjr
1st Class Member
Lakewood NJ
Foreman
Posts:372
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| | 05/23/2008 8:38 PM |
| | Polly is Bruce Engineering.... Google Bruce and it comes up as the 2nd one in the list or so. | |
Jason Kovac
Lakewood, NJ | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 05/23/2008 8:38 PM |
| | Thanks guys! Brit and Noel, hope to see you at PLS tomorrow. Noel, here's the address for Polly http://www.pollymodelengineering.co.uk/. Be careful though, they all all sorts of nice things there. Dave, thanks for the compliment, but I dunno if I'm good enough to write a book ( considering the good ones already out there). I would like to design a small coal fired beginners engine though. Maybe someday... | | | |
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livesteam5629
1st Class Member
Elkton, MD
Foreman
Posts:150
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| | 05/23/2008 10:06 PM |
| Justin,
Won't make PLS this weekend. Have to take daughter #2 up to Philly to look at a new car for her since she totaled her Durango a month or so ago. Thank God she was able to walk away from that disaster. Now she has a very nice set of wheels spoted at a dealer in Philly. A 2003 BMW with 30K on it. Got to look it over carefully.
Have fun at PLS and thanks for the Polly site.
Noel | |
Noel Crawford | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 05/29/2008 8:38 PM |
| Another quick little update.
The safeties arrived, and they look great!
The last tap and die arrived, so I have the check valve bushings in place.
And the throat sheet is soldered in place and trimmed (though I don't have a pic of that yet). It will look like a proper engine again soon!
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 08/18/2008 7:49 PM |
| Finally an update. The firebox is in! Have to add a few small parts to the backhead and then thats ready to solder in place.
Added the bush for the blower line and changed the gland on the throttle shaft from a cap type to a stuffed type. Also soldered on the manifold. The pressure gauge will go on the left and the blower on the right.
Some blower line parts. Changed my mind and went to a 90 degree valve and I'll need to make a banjo fitting to get the line to the backhead. I'll have pictures of that soon.
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 08/25/2008 6:29 PM |
| The Firing hole is in.
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livesteam5629
1st Class Member
Elkton, MD
Foreman
Posts:150
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| | 08/25/2008 7:16 PM |
| Justin;
Want to design and build your own engine? Well, I have the frame, drivers, siderods and mainrods plus some other parts for a 7/9ths 2-6-0. Talk to me man. It would make a beautiful coal fired loco.
Noel | |
Noel Crawford | |
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Steve Stockham
1st Class Member
Foreman
Posts:392
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| | 08/25/2008 9:13 PM |
| That is coming along beautifully! I can't wait to see what's next! | |
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tacfoley
1st Class Member
Conductor
Posts:575
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| | 08/26/2008 4:44 AM |
| Sorry - overlapping posts.
tac | | | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 08/26/2008 10:06 PM |
| Hey Noel! Sadly, as much as I'd love to, at this point I have too many projects going to start another one. Would be a very nice project and I am interested though! Going to be at PLS this weekend?
Steve, thanks for the kind words! I'll keep posting so long as there's people interested in seeing it.
Tonight I soldered the backhead in place for good:
And after some fiddling with the frame and suspension (the engine had a very noticable forward tilt), I was able to trim the firebox to its final size:
With the firebox trimmed, I was able to put the boiler in place AND mount up the rear truck for the first time. That's a pretty good feeling!
A top fitting for the water gauge and the mud ring will finish up the rear of the boiler. Then a steam dome and soldering in the front flue sheet will finish it. After that is the all-important hydro. The goal for this week is to get the mounting holes drilled and tapped to bring the rolling chassis with boiler to the PLS meet. | | | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 11/02/2008 10:44 AM |
| Well, after a bit of a hiatus here's another update. And this time it's a pretty big one. The top mount for the water gauge is in place, which means that except for the firing door mounts and catch the backhead is finished. I should have drilled the hole for the steam dome before the friebox and tubes went in, but I didn't which meant I had to bore it instead. The dome bush was then turned and threaded. And soldered in place. A nice, big easy to work with plug was turned up. It does have a hollow center for a pipe from the throttle to extend into to act as a dome. And put in place. | | | |
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Slipped Eccentric
1st Class Member
N.E. Pennsylvania
Brakeman
Posts:83
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| | 11/02/2008 10:55 AM |
| At that point I didn't need to solder anything more from the inside so the front flue sheet was ready to go in. First the front throttle bung was soldered in. The front fitting for the blower line was soldered on to the blower line itself. Another one that should have been done while the line was outside of the boiler. Make sure you're paying attention to the order of assembly for those of you playing at home... Unfortunatly I didn't get a clear picture of it. The front flue sheet was soldered in place, which means that except for the mudring, the boiler shell is finished! And finally, the first part of the superheater was formed. Getting into the home stretch now. | | | |
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